pairing thoughts on 'The Long Goodbye'

[tielan]

I've wanted to get this out for a week, but I thought I'd wait until things cooled down a little - and until the thoughts in my head had a chance to settle down. I think they're all sorted out now.

The Kiss

Am I the only person in the fandom who is going to call this the 'not-Shep/not-Weir' kiss? Because it was neither Sheppard nor Weir doing the kissing - or even choosing who was going to kiss who.

From what I saw, it was Phoebus who chose Sheppard to be Thalen's host. I took it to be primarily on the grounds that Sheppard's knowledge would make him a dangerous 'enemy-ally' (as Thalen, who Phoebus intended to fight) but a worse 'enemy-enemy' (as Sheppard, who would fight Phoebus).

And the kiss seemed to be part of this whole UST-challenge thing that Phoebus and Thalen had going, not any residual thought-feeling-desire on the part of either Shep or Liz. Shep looked about as enthusiastic at playing the part of 'husband to the alien who's imprinting Liz' as he did at discovering he was going to go bug-nuts in 'Conversion'; Liz's sink into the bed at the end suggests she wishes the damn thing had never happened.

...

Am I missing something?

The Confession

Uh, under duress, peoples! Thalen would say anything to keep his life at that point - wouldn't you? However, the fact that he chose to pick the "he cares about you more than you know" to say on top of "You kill me, you're killing him [Shep]" indicates that Thalen (and therefore probably Shep) thought that it might stay Teyla's hand. Which suggests that Thalen (and Shep) thought there was something there.

Except that Teyla isn't encouraging Shep. She doesn't encourage him after this ep, she didn't encourage him after 'Conversion'. I don't think Teyla's interested in John that way right now. It's a possibility, but it's not anything she wants at this moment.

Which says to me that if anyone's interested in anyone else, it's Shep who's interested in Teyla, but Teyla isn't interested back.

This seems to be reflected by the actors: Joe Flanigan says there's emotional tension between John and Teyla, but Rachel Luttrell doesn't seem to have a relationship preference for Teyla at this point.

Final Pairing Thoughts

None of this affects fanon, the pairings I like, or anyone's enjoyment of the show, unless you have to have your pairing canon. This is just the way I'm reading the episode cues.

Comments

[allisnow.livejournal.com]

Amusingly, while the majority of S/W people are willing to acknowledge they see where S/T shippers can be coming from in given situations to lead to their S/T feelings/observations, every S/T post I've read, both on LJ and on the GW forums, claim endlessly to never see anything remotely shippy at all between S/W.

Meaning what? That S/W shippers are somehow more magnanimous? ;)

[pellmelody.livejournal.com]

Meaning what? That S/W shippers are somehow more magnanimous? ;)

Perhaps. Or maybe just more open minded. :)

[tielan]

Okay. I'm afraid the only response that is presently coming to mind is "Certainly, they're more snide."

Except that would be manifestly unfair to the Shep/Weir fans I know who don't go around lumping 'the S/T fans' into a single amorphous entity the better to make what I feel are rather nastily superior comments about pairings and the people who like them.

So I think that's enough on this topic, thank you. You've made your position, attitude, and mentality more than clear in your last few comments.

Yes, allisnow, that includes you, too. Bzzt!

[pellmelody.livejournal.com]

So I think that's enough on this topic, thank you. You've made your position, attitude, and mentality more than clear in your last few comments.

Oh, I see. So the snide and pissy comments sent MY way are justifiable, and that I'm commenting on them to defend my position bugs you. And this comment proves my point.

You've made your position, attitude, and mentality more than clear in your last few comments.

Don't allow comments to an vaguely challenging and antagonist posting such as this, (esp. if it ends up in SGA newsletter) if you don't expect to get rebuttals or additional comments. Esp since the world of Atlantis fandom, believe it or not, doesn't revolve around your ship or mine.

[tielan]

There's quite a difference between a 'vaguely antagonistic posting' and calling all shippers of a specific pairing 'close-minded'.

I stated my experience within the SGA fandom and asked if there was anyone else with my view out there. You stated that your experience differed and then have repeatedly implied that your pairing and the shippers are superior to the opposition purely on the basis on that pairing.

Frankly, I couldn't care less what you ship. You could ship Heimdall/Wraith for all I care. However, the instant you start classifying people on what they ship is the instant I begin to back away.

That's my issue with you; not your opinions but how you've stated them in your comments.

[pellmelody.livejournal.com]

That's my issue with you; not your opinions but how you've stated them in your comments.

Then if you are concerned with HOW people state their comments, why didn't you publicly take the other poster to task and only me, esp. if, as you say here, you don't like others "classifying" people. You showed your own bigotry in the matter by not critizing the other poster when the first pissy comment was posted at me, which merely showed me you aren't what you want others to think you are.

For someone who doesn't care what people ship, you took an obvious side very quickly.

Enjoy your ship.

[tielan]

Correct me if I'm wrong, she asked for clarification on your statement, but I didn't say anything until you gave your answer in a manner that left no doubt that your attitude left much to be desired - whatever your ship.

And both you and she got the smackdown in my comment as well. She's stopped. You haven't.

And I will enjoy my ships, thanks - all of them.

[allisnow.livejournal.com]

Well at least you admit it.

[tielan]

So helpful. Bzzt!

[allisnow.livejournal.com]

Helpful... that's me!

*poke!*