SGA: seeds of greatness, jungle of mediocrity

[tielan]

You know when you read something that has the seeds of greatness in it, but all the writer managed was a jungle of mediocrity? I'm afraid that's what Stargate has become to me.

Ultimately, my issue with Stargate is that all the really cool, really interesting angles have been systematically cut out of the show, one by one, leaving something that doesn't really appeal to me.

Diplomatic relations with completely different cultures while in what should have remained a 'desert island' scenario where the options were 'assimilate or die', people with genes that give them access to technologies that integrate into the mind and the thoughts (both Ancient and Wraith), enemies that share a group mind but which can operate as individual units two - the exploration of the individual vs. society (both Wraith and Asuran), what it means to be cut off from your origins (the expedition in S1, Teyla and her people, Ronon and the destruction of his world) and find connection with people who are in a similar situation...

The talking points for Atlantis were: a new galaxy with new possibilities and new allies...

However, very little of that has been really explored. It's been touched upon, but not expanded upon. It's been highlighted, but not developed. It's been outlined, but not detailed. Granted, some areas of fanfic have taken the seeds of greatness and grown them into concepts that blow me away. It's just...disappointing not to see it in the show - to not even see the consideration of it in the show.

I have a theory on Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle and collapsing waveforms as they relate to TV shows.

Up until the point where it was cancelled, there was always the potential of Stargate Atlantis to make something of those seeds of greatness. Unfortunately, when it was cancelled, the waveform collapsed, taking away the echoes of possibility, and leaving only the cold hard reality.

And the cold hard reality is that Stargate Atlantis has not only missed its bullseye potential as part of the sci-fi genre, but it hasn't even come close to touching the target board.

So, yeah. Seeds of greatness. Jungle of mediocrity. Stargate Atlantis in a nutshell.

Comments

[grav-ity.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I miss the politics in a big way. Elizabeth and Teyla could have run the show, John and Ronon could have kept the little people alive and Rodney and Carson could made Wonderful Discoveries. It would have been great.

Did you read Mouth By Mouth The Legends Are Made (http://latentfunction.livejournal.com/258350.html)? It's got Action!Teyla and intergalactic politics...and Michael besides.

[tielan]

They really needed to balance out Atlantis/Earth with Pegasus, and they didn't. I don't think that any human culture was systematically treated as though they had equal rights to the Atlantis expedition. The closest they ever got was the Genii, and we saw just how Atlantis treated them when it came to Common Ground: habeas corpus for Ladon Radim? What's that?

I haven't, but I'll bookmark it for later reading. Maybe when the month of NaNo is over.

[therisingmoon.livejournal.com]

not only that but while the writers have some great ideas, it just doesn't translate well into their scripts and they tend to write themselves into corners with certain characters because they don't know what else to do with the characters because they've given all the meaty chunks of the episode to certain characters even though it was outside of their skill set.

that is a big issue i have with the show and it's really dampened the enjoyment of the show and i'll be seeking something new.

[tielan]

I'd seek something new...but Stargate hit a lot of my buttons-of-potential. Not just military but diplomatic. Not just Earth but intergalactical. Not just technology but people.

And so much of it wasted potential.

If I could, I'd gently extricate the characters and the story from the writers and do better things with them.

[rhianona]

You hit on a lot of reasons I don't love watching SGA anymore and the main reason my boyfr. scoffs at it and only watches it if I'm watching it at the time, which, with DVR, means he hasn't seen an episode with me since that god awful Elizabeth in a mental asylum episode.

One of the commentators for my recent SGA/TW fic said that she loved the cross and it made her want to go and watch SGA (I think she was a TW fan only). I told her not to bother. It's sad that the only reason I even attempt to watch episodes nowadays is to feel some inspiration and to be able to figure out what is going on in fandom.

[tielan]

I like the potential of the Stargate Universe - I haven't seen any show that has quite the same basic structure that I outlined to therisingmoon before: not just military but diplomatic, not just Earth but intergalactic, not just technology but people.

Granted, they haven't used any of that, so...I guess this is ground zero. :(

[madjm.livejournal.com]

The truth is that I'm glad it's been cancelled, so I don't have to try to keep watching it anymore out of some weird kind of loyalty. There have been a couple of decent episodes this season, but nothing that special.

I think you're right that it would have (well, possibly) been a better show had they not gotten in touch with earth so soon. When they were alone out there, meeting with and working with other worlds was much more important.

But, whatever, it doesn't really matter now.

[tielan]

I understand perfectly. I don't know that I could have coped with more seasons, either.

It could have been a better show if they'd written it better. But, as you pointed out, it's all water under the bridge now.

[beth-soprano.livejournal.com]

I sadly know what you mean. Even though they didn't really study the issues in seasons one - three, the show was fun, exciting and humorous. But in season four, (which I couldn't even watch entirely) it turned all dark side, (am I making any sense?) the good guys felt like the bad guys (which, can be okay, but it wasn't written right) and if they wanted to go with that angle (which they apparently did), the show should have gone entirely serious and dealt with issues.

[chyti.livejournal.com]

I swear they are still on earth since it is only earth perspectives that matter. This show has definitely missed the mark entirely. Having the show set in another galaxy where you didn't have to conform to earth standards left them with hugh opportunities but they choose to focus on earth instead of pegasus

[timespirt.livejournal.com]

TPTB were not really as into this show as SG-1, when they could not advance the story into things unimagined they should have brought in fresh new writers, This show needed new blood to infuse it and not the old boys club that couldn't think outside of the box they put themselves in. In 10 years you could not exhaust the story-lines that one could come up with for a show like SGA. Killing off favored characters that were very much a part of the story, because they just couldn't stop tinkering or trying to find out if they could remove stuff and see how far they could push the audience! They just lost the whole concept of the story along the way. TPTB already knew that they didn't want to continue with SGA because they had to have been discussing the new BabyGate 90210 months or longer before the announcement. I believe as far back as ComiCon or earlier they knew. Some of the story-lines for this season are not bad, but you can tell that it had the feeling like they had already moved on to their next project and felt they didn't have to put much effort into this years episodes. The lack of full team related episodes, not advancing stories already started in preceding years, not following through with the original outline of the show in the first year that pulled us all in. The ego's of these writers and producers to think that throwing a bone, any bone would keep us all sucking after them and whatever scraps they gave us! I still love this show and the characters and always will. I feel bad about not seeing what more could have been explored and brought out, what could have been if greed didn't always factor into the equation. I have my DVD's, fanfic and my thoughts and dreams for what could have been and that will have to be enough, because there isn't anything else.

[tielan]

That's a whole lotta text to read at once without breaks. (Next time, maybe put some paragraph spaces in - hit 'return' or 'enter' twice instead of just once.)

But I get your gist.

[grav-ity.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I miss the politics in a big way. Elizabeth and Teyla could have run the show, John and Ronon could have kept the little people alive and Rodney and Carson could made Wonderful Discoveries. It would have been great.

Did you read Mouth By Mouth The Legends Are Made (http://latentfunction.livejournal.com/258350.html)? It's got Action!Teyla and intergalactic politics...and Michael besides.

[tielan]

They really needed to balance out Atlantis/Earth with Pegasus, and they didn't. I don't think that any human culture was systematically treated as though they had equal rights to the Atlantis expedition. The closest they ever got was the Genii, and we saw just how Atlantis treated them when it came to Common Ground: habeas corpus for Ladon Radim? What's that?

I haven't, but I'll bookmark it for later reading. Maybe when the month of NaNo is over.

[therisingmoon.livejournal.com]

not only that but while the writers have some great ideas, it just doesn't translate well into their scripts and they tend to write themselves into corners with certain characters because they don't know what else to do with the characters because they've given all the meaty chunks of the episode to certain characters even though it was outside of their skill set.

that is a big issue i have with the show and it's really dampened the enjoyment of the show and i'll be seeking something new.

[tielan]

I'd seek something new...but Stargate hit a lot of my buttons-of-potential. Not just military but diplomatic. Not just Earth but intergalactical. Not just technology but people.

And so much of it wasted potential.

If I could, I'd gently extricate the characters and the story from the writers and do better things with them.

[rhianona]

You hit on a lot of reasons I don't love watching SGA anymore and the main reason my boyfr. scoffs at it and only watches it if I'm watching it at the time, which, with DVR, means he hasn't seen an episode with me since that god awful Elizabeth in a mental asylum episode.

One of the commentators for my recent SGA/TW fic said that she loved the cross and it made her want to go and watch SGA (I think she was a TW fan only). I told her not to bother. It's sad that the only reason I even attempt to watch episodes nowadays is to feel some inspiration and to be able to figure out what is going on in fandom.

[tielan]

I like the potential of the Stargate Universe - I haven't seen any show that has quite the same basic structure that I outlined to therisingmoon before: not just military but diplomatic, not just Earth but intergalactic, not just technology but people.

Granted, they haven't used any of that, so...I guess this is ground zero. :(

[madjm.livejournal.com]

The truth is that I'm glad it's been cancelled, so I don't have to try to keep watching it anymore out of some weird kind of loyalty. There have been a couple of decent episodes this season, but nothing that special.

I think you're right that it would have (well, possibly) been a better show had they not gotten in touch with earth so soon. When they were alone out there, meeting with and working with other worlds was much more important.

But, whatever, it doesn't really matter now.

[tielan]

I understand perfectly. I don't know that I could have coped with more seasons, either.

It could have been a better show if they'd written it better. But, as you pointed out, it's all water under the bridge now.

[beth-soprano.livejournal.com]

I sadly know what you mean. Even though they didn't really study the issues in seasons one - three, the show was fun, exciting and humorous. But in season four, (which I couldn't even watch entirely) it turned all dark side, (am I making any sense?) the good guys felt like the bad guys (which, can be okay, but it wasn't written right) and if they wanted to go with that angle (which they apparently did), the show should have gone entirely serious and dealt with issues.

[chyti.livejournal.com]

I swear they are still on earth since it is only earth perspectives that matter. This show has definitely missed the mark entirely. Having the show set in another galaxy where you didn't have to conform to earth standards left them with hugh opportunities but they choose to focus on earth instead of pegasus

[timespirt.livejournal.com]

TPTB were not really as into this show as SG-1, when they could not advance the story into things unimagined they should have brought in fresh new writers, This show needed new blood to infuse it and not the old boys club that couldn't think outside of the box they put themselves in. In 10 years you could not exhaust the story-lines that one could come up with for a show like SGA. Killing off favored characters that were very much a part of the story, because they just couldn't stop tinkering or trying to find out if they could remove stuff and see how far they could push the audience! They just lost the whole concept of the story along the way. TPTB already knew that they didn't want to continue with SGA because they had to have been discussing the new BabyGate 90210 months or longer before the announcement. I believe as far back as ComiCon or earlier they knew. Some of the story-lines for this season are not bad, but you can tell that it had the feeling like they had already moved on to their next project and felt they didn't have to put much effort into this years episodes. The lack of full team related episodes, not advancing stories already started in preceding years, not following through with the original outline of the show in the first year that pulled us all in. The ego's of these writers and producers to think that throwing a bone, any bone would keep us all sucking after them and whatever scraps they gave us! I still love this show and the characters and always will. I feel bad about not seeing what more could have been explored and brought out, what could have been if greed didn't always factor into the equation. I have my DVD's, fanfic and my thoughts and dreams for what could have been and that will have to be enough, because there isn't anything else.

[tielan]

That's a whole lotta text to read at once without breaks. (Next time, maybe put some paragraph spaces in - hit 'return' or 'enter' twice instead of just once.)

But I get your gist.