who's to blame?

[tielan]

How about we go through who isn't to blame?

1. Sam Carter, Amanda Tapping, and Sam-fans

Amanda Tapping did not walk into the offices at Bridge Studios, slam her fist down on Brad Wright's desk and say, "Put Carter in Atlantis, dammit, and kick Higginson's character out!" We do not even have hard proof that Elizabeth will be removed as expedition leader, let alone that Carter will replace her. And even if this was the case, your fury is still misplaced - both against the character of Sam Carter and the actress who plays her.

ETA: Apparently, Sam Carter comes to Atlantis with her own ship. Ship's captains do not take permanent control of Atlantis. So if anyone should be frothing over Sam 'replacing' their favourite character, it seems as though it should be the Caldwell fans.


2. Teyla and the Teyla-fans

There is no 'fair' system of 'who should have their storylines cut from the show'. Screentime and minor storylines may be picked up later. The writers apparently have stories they want to tell about Teyla now, even if they haven't been inclined or able to tell them in past seasons. And if it's a question of less screentime for Elizabeth, why take it away from a character who already has almost no screentime, who has several aspects in common with Elizabeth as well as a lot of differences, and would provide a Pegasus diplomatic (subtle, tactful) angle to Elizabeth's Earth-based negotiation skills (direct, forceful)?


3. The Sheppard/Teyla fans

As a pairing, Sheppard/Weir was always unlikely at best. Joe Flanigan said as much in interviews. So did Torri Higginson. Brad Wright implied it from the first ep. The interaction between the two was primarily as friends and colleagues - no matter how many people read into the interactions as a pairing. Superior numbers work in a democracy; but the show isn't a democracy. Elizabeth's departure from the show has little to do with 'making Sheppard/Teyla palateable' to the audience, or 'leaving the way free for an unlikely ship'.

ETA: Rule #1 about Amanda Tapping and any 'ship support' comments made by her: she will answer with a leaning towards what she thinks the audience wishes to hear. I love the actress, but she's a 'politic ship supporter' - six years of interviews with her about the Sam/Jack pairing makes that very clear. Plus, you know the occasional comments of support by interviwed guest actors on a show has so much impact on the writers.


4. TPTB

Yes, I know this one is probably the hardest to swallow.

These guys are doing a job. It's probably a pretty cool job, but at the end of the day, they, too, are employees. They are subject to the whims and laws of the Sci-Fi Channel production company, of MGM/Sony, of the fickle gods of television programming market forces, and of the actors hired to play their parts.

Brad Wright might have been the one to break the news, but he isn't necessarily the person who made The Unkindest Cut.

Torri may have opted to spend time doing something other than Stargate. An MGM executive may have said, "The brunette who leads the show - she's not doing much, we don't want to pay her a full retainer. She's going to be a recurring character." Sci-Fi Contracts may have said, "We're optioning Amanda Tapping for another season of Stargate - she's gotta have a speaking role in at least fourteen episodes. Make it so." Any of these situations - or all of them, or parts of all, or just a few - may have happened. None of them may have happened - something else may have required the change(s) that are coming to the show.

However, a lot of these projected situations are beyond the capabilities of TPTB to control. They're unlikely to be the ones making the waves, they're just on the surfboard with the arching tube crashing over their heads, probably desperately hoping that they make it out and don't get dumped.

I'm not over-fond of the way TPTB have been writing the show. I don't hide that opinion. On the other hand, I realise what a difficult job it's been, writing for two shows and (IMO) shorting both. And Rob Cooper might write a pretty damn awesome script, but the man's got a really weird vision when it comes to showrunning.

They might be to blame - I acknowledge that. But until we know more, why don't we hold our peace and wait for the bigger picture? It might waiting until Season Four has screened, but the wait might be worth it. And if it isn't, we can all scream very loudly at each other and at the studios.

ETA: In the interview, Brad Wright actually states that Elizabeth will be a recurring character for a while. This is quite probably a non-permanent change. Which suggests that Torri Higginson had something she wanted to do for a while, so they minimised Elizabeth's role. It also (along with Carter's command of a ship) puts paid to the idea that Sam is 'replacing' Elizabeth.

--

I may need to go lie down. I'm showing signs of sanity in fandom, and we can't have that!

ETA: Updated 8:30am with clarifications and new bits of information that have come to light.

Comments

[ryf.livejournal.com]

Ah, the voice of reason, thank you for this. As much as I will miss frequent Weir appearances, I am excited about going to have AT on SGA. And Sam/Teyla interaction should prove to be interesting, as well as her further interactions with McKay.

[tielan]

Considering the current state of Elizabeth's appearances, I don't know that she's going to be that seriously reduced in screentime.

And I'd be more excited about Sam on SGA if I knew that they weren't going to have her and Rodney saving the day all the time.

Actually, I'd be more excited about SGA if I knew that John and Rodney weren't going to save the day all the time.

But yes. Sam/Teyla interaction! having a wet t-shirt competition in the gateroom!

[sjhw-tolerance.livejournal.com]

Well done...it's always interesting times in fandom. :-)

[tielan]

Now that's a curse if I ever heard one... :)

[balikpulang.livejournal.com]

Thank you for this. I'm not sure if I've ever posted here before (if not, hello!) but I absolutely appreciate you sharing your thoughts. I just got back from work and saw all the news on GW (!) Though I can understand why emotions are running wild, I agree that we shouldn't over-react. Let's see the whats and whys of S3's ending, and extend some faith and goodwill to the folks that have brought us 10 years of Stargate(s) thus far. Cheers, lis

[tielan]

Well, I had my knee-jerk reaction before, so I can understand the initial reaction. Then I read and thought it through and considered the changes.

I'm still not entirely happy and a bit worried, but I can wait to see what's going to happen.

[krazykitkat.livejournal.com]

All completely right.

I'm not happy about it, at all, but it's a tv show, things move on, people move on. We're not party to the whys and wherefores. And I certainly don't understand people blaming the first three for it.

I'm not sure whether I'll still be there. Elizabeth is by far my favourite character. I'm way behind on watching, just started my season 2 dvds yesterday and was quite bored by the first episode. I had watched it before, so maybe that was why, or I've been out of it for ages and just need to get back in. But if I don't get back into it, less screen time for Elizabeth may be the end.

[tielan]

Someone I know has made the point: Elizabeth and Teyla are currently being treated as 'recurring' characters anyway.

Which sucks. Because the girls could do some awesome things in the show, together and individually (if the writing team wasn't all clueless guys).

[snoggingpicard.livejournal.com]

Thanks so much for this -- the voice of reason during the storm. You = awesome.

[tielan]

Someone's gotta be the bucket of cold water to stop the screaming hysterics. :)

*smooches*

[tv-elf.livejournal.com]

I may need to go lie down. I'm showing signs of sanity in fandom, and we can't have that!

Snicker. Next up, on tonight's news: Hell has in fact frozen over.

{{HUGS}} We'll find a new fandom to ostracize you... How do you feel about Supernatural? ;)

[tielan]

Are you trying to kill me, hon? Supernatural fandom is like the alligator pit!

[rhianona]

I was thinking about this last night. As you might know, I hate fan wank. I keep my distance from it to the point that the only way I even connect through the fandoms are through fic writing. I don't belong to *any* comms that deal with news about the show or that really allow discussion of the show beyond fic. It doesn't mean I'm not aware of it, just that I keep my distance.

I'm also a really late fan of the SG'verse. It was only when I realized that both Ben and Claudia were on SG1 that I decided to watch it, and I picked up SGA as a whim b/c of it. So yeah. I started watching SG1 and SGA about a week before season 10 and 3 started, respectively.

This is all an introduction to my little thoughts on this. Truthfully, as wonderful as the potential Elizabeth as a character is, TPTB dropped the ball on her character. It's only now that we're even getting something of a character for her. Am I surprised? Not really. I also wouldn't be surprised that the reason for bringing AT onboard is to help boost SGA ratings - bring on a likeable character from SG1. Personally, I don't think she is the right character to bring on - there are too many places for conflict: ie. Sam v. Rodney in the lab; Sam v. John in terms of command structure, etc... I think it was pretty obvious from the moment SG1 was cancelled that at least one or two of the SG1 characters would show up on SGA. I think the most suitable would be Daniel, considering how often he lobbied to go to Atlantis, but obviously, that is not in the cards... or hasn't been mentioned yet.

And lastly, on the fandom: The SG fandom has always been a fandom I never got. I mean, when Sam was dating Pete, AT was getting HATE MAIL b/c of it. HATE MAIL. WTF? And, whether or not you agree with the casting of Ben for season 9 and the removal of RDA, to boycott the show b/c the actor in question wanted to spend more time with his family is beyond insane to me. I just don't get it.

[tielan]

I think one reason Daniel isn't going to Atlantis is because his character is needed in the SG1 storylines against the Orii, while Sam isn't.

I don't know how it's going to work out, but I hope it'll be watchable.

If they actually succeed in giving Teyla some decent scenes, episodes, and a plot arc (as Joe said they were going to do back in October 2006), then I'm not terribly worried about Sam coming onto the show.

If it becomes the John, Rodney, and Sam show, though, I'll be seriously frustrated.

[cala-jane.livejournal.com]

OMG! a normal person in the fandom!
*panics*
*runs away screaming*

[tielan]

*snerks*

[grav-ity.livejournal.com]

Hi! Unrelated, but do you have a link for "To Serve A Queen"? I went looking a bit and couldn't find it. Er...the motive is that I am reccing for "The Essential Dex Fics". Thanks!

[tielan]

To Serve A Queen

[toasteronfire.livejournal.com]

Actually, fandom has taken this better than I thought it would. Implosion yes, turning rabidly against each other not so much. Yet, anyway.

But yes, I did see a comment about how TPTB are getting rid of Elizabeth because they didn't want to deal with S/W and would rather pave the way for S/T. Wow, nothing like a huge amount of fanwank to keep the shipper wars alive. o_O

I feel bad for Sam fans - lots of people are going to be vilifying Sam before she even gets there thanks to the feeling that she's replacing Elizabeth. (For the record, I read somewhere on GW that Sam will be in charge of Atlantis, no idea where the link is though.)

All in all I'm still waiting on the details - we have no idea what happens to Elizabeth and in what capacity we'll see her next season. It could end up working out. It could fail miserably. We'll see.

[tielan]

I did see a comment about how TPTB are getting rid of Elizabeth because they didn't want to deal with S/W and would rather pave the way for S/T.

Yep, seen that, too. *grimace*

Let's haul out the ship conspiracy theories! Maximum denial for minimum effort!

The only thing I'm seeing for the next six months is the wank. Cast off all restraint! Full wank ahead!

[tray-lord.livejournal.com]

Thank you for this. It's nice to see that some people are reacting with some sanity over everything.

[tielan]

Well, I am an evil Shep/Teyla and Teyla fan, so my word probably doesn't carry much weight in the quarters that need to hear it.

Such is fandom!

[doxymom.livejournal.com]

Well said, Tielan!

Thanks.

[tielan]

Mostly, my brain wanted to do something to stop (or at least slow) the mad circus of infanity that was going on all around.

However, I doubt this message will reach those who most need it. :(

[mrshamill.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I think I love you too.

Why, Ah feel... tried, violated, COMMON, evanh... Ah may jest fayent. /scarlett o'hara

[tielan]

*fayents alongside*

[oparu.livejournal.com]

Wow. Lovely. I feel at peace with it now. Thank you for your sanity. I needed it. :)

[tielan]

Welcome. I needed the sanity check as well after my initial knee-jerk reaction - maybe not as extreme as some, but still worried enough.

Found this on sga_newsletter. Just wanted to say...

[whetherwoman.livejournal.com]

THANK YOU.

THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU.

Here's the way I look at it: The last time TPTB made an unpopular casting choice (replacing Ford with Ronon) it worked out pretty well. I miss Ford, but damn do I love Ronon. So... why not give them a chance? Jump ship after the first half of season 4 is despicable.

In any case, THANK YOU for this post.

Re: Found this on sga_newsletter. Just wanted to say...

[tielan]

Welcome. I'm trying to provide an alternative to MAD PANIC OMG!

[wraithfodder.livejournal.com]

I dare say the reasonable fans (sure, there are some unreasonable ones) do NOT blame Amanda Tapping for the role. The producers made the decision, for better or worse (we'll just have to see).

The rest - haven't read much re Teyla. Torri, all we do know is she's now recurring, not a regular cast member. So, that's fact. The rest is speculation. However, since there are financial considerations, one can speculate, amenably, that if you add someone in, someone else might need to be cut back to balance the budget. I've seen it done in jobs I'm in and I'm sure in show biz it's no different.

We'll have to see if this helps Atlantis or sinks it.

[tielan]

I spotted a couple of 'This is all Teyla's fault! If they'd taken her out, Elizabeth could have stayed!' complaints. I figured it was best to head it off at the pass.

And I guess my perspective is that there's a slew of other aspects about the show that may help Atlantis or sink it. The cast changes aren't the only thing that affect a show - although they make the biggest waves in fandom.

[chalk-of-doom.livejournal.com]

I'm just wandering in from sga_newsletter, but I feel I must join in the chorus of "OH THANK GOD A SANE COMMENTARY ON THIS WHOLE DEBACLE".

*worships*

[tielan]

*grins*

You're welcome!

I understand why people are panicking - I'm not pleased about a lot of aspects of this situation, but waiting and seeing what happens is what I see as the most sensible option.

And, yeah, bucket of cold water is me. *wry smile*

[canlib.livejournal.com]

Yay! A voice of reason! *cheers*

You know, I was upset about AT coming over when I first heard simply because I don't think the writers have a good handle on how to progress the McKay-Carter interaction beyond their bad start on SG1. But after reading a bunch of posts on GW, I'm far more pissed off at certain people in the fandom than I am at tptb.

[tielan]

after reading a bunch of posts on GW, I'm far more pissed off at certain people in the fandom than I am at tptb

I understand this.

Sometimes I'd swear that fandom is a delicate balance of 'who do we hate more?'

[one-in-progress.livejournal.com]

What a lot of sense :)

I'm really looking forward to Carter (as an SG1 fan before I was an SGA fan). What disappoints me is that it seems to be a zero-sum game for the female characters. SGA was pretty revolutionary in having two main characters who are women, and apparently three would just be ridiculously over top, actually potentially creating an equal number of male and female heroes! So now we're all the way back down to one, the standard female superhero allotment, and two recurring. Argh. Still, at least we've made some progress since ST:TOS.

[canlib.livejournal.com]

There's also the new doctor, so maybe that's one regular and three recurring or even two regular and two recurring. ;)

[wemblee.livejournal.com]

Mmmm. Tastes like sanity. Thank you.

[ladyjax.livejournal.com]

Notice how no one suggests they drop one of the guys unless it's Jason Momoa.

*runs away*

[moebius-2.livejournal.com]

Can I just say you completely rock?

[tielan]

Thanks.

Admittedly, all this was said just after the announcement, and in the interim six weeks have passed, in which major wank has happened and during which time Joe Mallozzi has been baiting the piranhas over on his blog.

But as far as the first three go, I'm pretty sure that AT/Sam, RL/Teyla, and the Shep/Teyla fans are innocent of the charge of TH/Elizabeth's change to recurring status.